Jump to content


Penalties for stupid behaviour?


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
32 replies to this topic

#1 newbie2wheel

newbie2wheel

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 31 posts

Posted 02 August 2015 - 09:40 AM

I do not race so maybe I am not qualified to comment, but yesterday in the Master race at the Grove I watched a cyclist, #205 riding for thecyclery.net, directly cause a sever crash that resulted in a serious injury. #205 for some reason saw fit while riding in the middle of the peloton to raise his left arm, turn his head and point / yell something to his comrades sitting under thecyclery.net tent. When he returned his hand to the handlebar and brought his head and body back down, he veered right clipping the backs of three separate bikes while he swerved. Somewhere in that mess a rider crashed suffering at least severe road rash on his upper back. The man remained down for a good 10 minutes, some of it he seemed to be knocked out. #205 in the mean time managed to stay up but he had damaged his front wheel, I assume broken spokes from the couple of skewers he tangled with on the rear wheels of the bikes he collided with. He dismounted and examined his bike for a couple of minutes then calmly walked his bike back to the thecyclery.net tent where they gave him a replacement wheel. In walking back to the tent he walked right by the injured rider laying on the street, did not  look down, did not stop to say anything or ask how he was. I saw him in the peloton two more laps, then he disappeared, or at least I didn't see him again.

I was up on the balcony of Urban Chestnut with a clear view of  the entire thing. I was so pissed off I wanted to yell at him but I held my tongue. As the day went on I became more and more pissed off thinking about the injured rider who this morning, if he is not in the hospital, he is certainly suffering pain from the stupidity of one asshole. So the question is, is there no penalty for being an idiot? Shouldn't this behavior be punished by a suspension or something. I know there was no intent but to be so stupid as to endanger people, if nothing else he needs to be called out.

#2 BigBlue

BigBlue

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 191 posts

Posted 02 August 2015 - 10:52 AM

That is terrible, and surprising, as most Masters racers have amazing bike handling skills and tons of experience.  Hope whoever got crashed out recovers well.

#3 MTBadam

MTBadam

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 16 posts

Posted 02 August 2015 - 02:00 PM

I too am enraged at this behavior just from reading the post. Sounds like a arrogant A-hole to me. Should look up his number from the race results and make his name public. This kind of behavior can result in deaths (read the pinned article at the top of this forum) and this guy should be made publicly aware that other cyclists will not put up with this behavior.  At least from now on everyone should stay away from Old Guys in TheCyclery.net jerseys....you just never know if you'll be next to get knocked down.

#4 Birkenfeld1

Birkenfeld1

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 667 posts

Posted 02 August 2015 - 03:16 PM

As a spectator you observed very well and I assume you enjoy watching clean exciting sport. So accidents happen, but this one as observed by you was 100% preventable, absolutely not justified and the behavior of Chris Martel absolutely unexceptable.
I was in this race  as well and like me myself, nobody else like to crash period.
I hope the injured rider is okay!  Best wishes for a successful recovery.

And for C.Martel....."Apologize" to the one you caused harm....to the spectators and  to the rest of the Mastersfield.   Perhaps contact a Psychiatrist.....looks like you need one.......!!!!!

Bernd  Faust  - Master 50+ -
Birkenfeld1-Puma

#5 cverry

cverry

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 81 posts

Posted 02 August 2015 - 08:32 PM

Gentlemen, let's behave as such. To call people out, whom you do not know, as "arrogant A-holes", and then to suggest they have mental illness is taking this conversation too far. I doubt you would say such words if you were sitting across the table from the person you are directing these comments too. You should treat social media the same way, The distance of a computer and keyboard do not lessen the significance of the statements.

Opening a conversation on the topic is what such mediums are intended to do. Slandering the person, name calling, and questioning the mental stability is not. Please do not make the mistake to imagine you are beyond error too. None of us have gotten through life fault free, and we have all made errors in judgement that had no malintent. Let's extend the same level of understanding we all hoped to receive during those periods of time to whichever rider may have contributed to the injury.

I was in the race. I saw the crash. I have some issues with a non-racer calling out someone who has raced for countless yrs. The peloton is always chaotic, even more so in a crit. Not one of us wishes harm on any other rider in the field. To imply any different is simply false. And to be judge, jury and executioner is to be inviting misperceptions and inaccuracies. The cycling community is small, too small to be making enemies. Let's assume best intentions. Let's open the conversation. Let's avoid name calling and character judging. The Masters race is supposed to be a mature one. Let's show through our words that we are indeed more mature than my 3 yr old children.

Christian Verry

#6 creedmonster

creedmonster

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 41 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 07:08 AM

I would have to echo Verry's comments above.  Chris is a very upstanding, experienced bicycle racer.  Accidents do happen, and are expected, especially in criteriums.  The accident was just that, not intentional.  We all hope that the injured rider is ok.  

Chris Creed

#7 creedmonster

creedmonster

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 41 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 07:41 AM

and technically speaking...you could say that I caused the crash that sent the injured rider to the ground.....I slowed down to avoid the crash, and he slammed into the back of me.  As I said, we all hope the best for the rider.  Nobody ever wants to see injuries occur in the sport that we all love.

#8 slp_1975

slp_1975

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 12 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 07:44 AM

I saw the crash too.  My husband was in the race as well, that was maybe his 3rd Masters race.  I'm fairly certain if he'd have sat up like that in the front of the group, and caused a crash, this topic of conversation would be totally different.

I came to the forum this morning to see if any updates on the injured racer.  Hope he is ok.

#9 dwarfed centipede

dwarfed centipede

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 112 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 09:35 AM

I haven't raced with the P1,2's that often, but noticed this one guy that was yelling at someone else for braking in a turn and then they started jawing at each other.  This guy even went so far as to cut the other guy off on purpose and try to crash him after this verbal argument.  I would think this is unacceptable behavior but is this common in these high ranking fields?  I've raced with this guy on Tuesday nights and he does ride dirty, but I've never seen him try to crash someone like this before.  What can we do in this situation?  I'm afraid to confront this guy since he seems so hot-headed and I don't want him holding a grudge and doing this behavior to me.

#10 Birkenfeld1

Birkenfeld1

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 667 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 06:46 PM

I guess everybody missed the point....I have other eyewitnesses....C. Martel went back into the race, probably without reporting to the pit...he was worried about his bike and front wheel....instead of the injured rider.........that is dead wrong ,  unsportsmanlike and unexceptional.

Bernd Faust.

P.S. I applaud the spectators point of view.
Birkenfeld1-Puma

#11 54x12

54x12

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 75 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 09:01 PM

I should first say I'm very shaken by the comments on this thread. All I can offer is my side of what happened. Coming up the start/finish I did ask for feedback on break from sidelines as I have countless other races and as do countless other riders. This is nothing new to this sport. I also am hyper sensitive to my surroundings in a pack and holding a strait line is top of mind. But from my perspective in the pack and not on the sidelines, a rider rode into me as I did this and or rode into another rider who rode into me. After the crash I got a spare wheel from our team manager and proceeded to the wheel pit (ref can confirm). At this time I had "no" clue a rider went down until I was told this post crash in pack. Upon the finish I immediately went back to scene of crash and asked our team manager if rider was ok and was told he was up and had road rash but would be ok. I was grateful for that news. The fact that a rider went down disturb me, a lot, even though many here said I'm heartless and uncaring of others and only care about the race. I did seek out if he was ok. And I did go to wheel pit. I've been racing a long time and would never intentionally ride in a careless manner that would endanger any other rider. I know this explanation of my side will still get many negative comments and thoughts, but all I can say is it's unlikely I'll race after this again.

- Chris

#12 hairdoo

hairdoo

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 6 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 09:27 PM

Chris Martel is a class act on and off the bike. He is a great person and competitor. He has been racing bikes on and off for the last 30+ years, knows how to handle his bike, and has great race awareness. He would be the first to admit if he did something to cause a crash or misfortune to others. I think it is shitty to call him out without talking to him and getting his version of the events.

Chris, I hope you don't let the opinions of this idiot affect your decision to continue to race.

-Chris Harre

#13 creedmonster

creedmonster

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 41 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 09:47 PM

What Chris(Harre) said!  It is bike racing.  We all know what we are getting into, when we decide not to sit on the couch, and try to go out and have some fun.  For me personally, it has been super fun racing with guys, that I first rode with back in 1987-88 in Springfield, Mo.  We cannot allow crashing to stop this love for the bikes! I actually crashed Harre at a Cross race a few years back after I called it(jokingly), but I did take him out...on accident...it is what can happen at a race.  Has anybody talked to Mark, the guy that....as I slammed my brakes on, crashed into me, not Chris Martel....actually, I am pretty sure that nobody around Chris, crashed?  The race has reached out, but to my knowledge has not made contact.  

Marty...don't you dare think about not doing it because of this..just as Mark shouldn't think of not racing again...stuff happens...

Bones heal, Chicks Dig Scars, and Glory Lives Forever!

Chris Creed

#14 cverry

cverry

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 81 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 09:49 PM

Bernd, I think your point was made. There's was no mistake. You named names, laid blame with incomplete information and questioned Chris's mental state of mind in a fairly malicious manner. What part did we miss?

As the comments from Chris Creed have made clear and as Chris Martel himself has stated, your perception was a misperception. This is the problem when we assume we know best. Start the conversation with an intent to gather information next time. Save the judgement until the facts are in front of you. And assume best intentions. These are skills of fairness and maturity I work to instill in my children everyday and expect from other adults. We all need a reminder to use them more often.

#15 creedmonster

creedmonster

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 41 posts

Posted 03 August 2015 - 10:03 PM

Thank you Christian! Let us not forget, how small the cycling community is.  Is it really worth throwing stones?   I would like to think that we are all out there showing people how to have a great time, and extend their life through the use of 2 wheels!